Interview With Thomas Horn, Controversial Author of The Ahriman Gate

How does one go from exorcist to ufologist? I found Tom Horn to be an interesting man; an enigma who assuredly knows more than he's saying. Though right now he's saying a lot!

By Joe Peterson
RNU News Special Report

JP: Tom, thank you for agreeing to do this interview.

TH: Certainly, Joe, you're welcome, glad to do it.

JP: Well, I was very interested after hearing you on radio recently. The fact that a conservative with your credentials was willing to talk about UFOs, life on other planets, government coverup, it was a bit of a surprise. I want to ask you the hard questions, but first, give us a little background if you will as to why you are talking about this now.

TH: Let me begin at my childhood. My father grew up riding fence lines for the Bard Ranch, the largest open range cattle ranch in those days with tens of thousands of open acres. Consequently, Dad knew the Arizona desert like the back of his hand. After returning from the Korean War, he took a job as a policeman in the small town of El Mirage, Arizona. Years later he worked with Dell Webb, who built Las Vegas, and as you know the Mafia was tied in to all of that in those days. Dad stayed with Webb for twenty-five years or more, building Youngtown and then Sun City.

JP: I heard you start to say something about this on radio the other night and then the host cautioned you about it. Is this where you think your dad became a connected man, through the Dell Webb corporation?

TH: I can only speculate on that. But it was about this time that Dad, who loved to deer hunt, made an amazing discovery. Several large and spherical craters, perhaps twenty feet across and eight feet deep, were discovered in an unexplored section of the range where he was hunting. The cavities were so precise that it looked as if an enormous white-hot ball had routered into the rock. The finish on the walls was such that rainwater filled the orbs. The sides of the holes were slick and each pool contained deer that had fallen in and drowned while attempting to drink the water. Dad took pictures, including the one I gave you where the curvature of the hole is distorted by a bend in the old photo. He showed the pictures to the family and I remember being especially impressed, and later he led a representative of the Army Corps of Engineers to the location. The origin of the craters was never determined, and the Corps of Engineers dynamited the pools with rock to protect the wildlife. The Phoenix Gazette or another paper ran an article on the baffling holes, reprinted photographs of my father kneeling beside the orbs, and that seemed to be the end of the story.

JP: But it wasn't.

TH: Not at all. On November 5, 1975, along the northeastern ridge of that mountain range, Travis Walton stepped out of his pick-up to look at what he called a glowing object. According to the report, while a crew of loggers waited nearby, Travis approached the UFO and was jolted by an energy wave. As his companions fled in terror, Travis was taken on-board the so-called alien spacecraft and subjected to a variety of physical examinations. His story, Fire in the Sky, was made into a motion picture. Supposedly it's the best documented account of a UFO abduction ever recorded. I don't know if Walton’s story was true or if there was a connection between his experience and my father's earlier discovery in the same area.

JP: But immediately after this event, things got weird at your home.

TH: According to my mother, who by the way didn't believe in anything about UFOs or aliens...

JP: Let me interrupt. As I understand it, there was no discussion at anytime in your family before or after these events about aliens.

TH: Absolutely not. First of all, we're talking over forty years ago. There was no consensus back then about alien abduction or any widespread characterizations of alien Greys. Secondly, we were a very old fashioned Pentecostal Christian home. We weren't allowed to watch TV, go to movies, any of that. We'd have gotten spanked for even mentioning such absurd ideas! [Tom laughs]

JP: Yet something very unusual started happening right after your dad's discovery.

TH: Yes. As I started to say, according to Mom, my aunt who lived a few doors down from us came to the house one day. She was ashen white, visibly shaken, wanting to know what the 'thing' was that had been hovering above our house. Mom went outside and nothing was there.

JP: Your aunt described it as a shiny circular object.

TH: That's right.

JP: And following this?

TH: A few nights later, and I still remember this vividly, I was shook from bed by the sound of my sister screaming. Horrible, terrifying screaming. Everybody in the house jumped out of bed and ran to her room. She was sitting up in bed, and the look on her face, it was unlike anything I've seen since. Mom stayed with her that night. Put a Bible under her pillow, anointing cloths on her and prayed with her. Some time later Mom told me that my sister had woke that night and saw small, bulbous-headed Grey men standing around her bed.

JP: You said in one interview that your Mom's prayers made a difference in keeping the small men away.

TH: They certainly appeared to. I draw this conclusion because over the next forty years the phenomenon happened over and over and whenever prayer was made, the event would stop for a while.

JP: Then start over again.

TH: Yes.

JP: Is this why you place a spiritual element on this activity, whatever it is?

TH: That's one part of it. Remember, I pastored for over twenty years and was an evangelist for some time too.

JP: Wasn't you connected to Trinity Broadcasting and those people at the time?

TH: Uh-huh, had my own television and radio program. Yet even during those years I investigated my sister's phenomenon through the filter of my conservative upbringing and found that there are many layers to the abduction phenomenon. I concluded that the experience is real is some cases, but how do you interpret it? It's at least as complex as the physical world.

JP: Weren't you also an exorcist for the church?

TH: In evangelical Christianity it's different than the Catholic Church. We don't refer to ourselves the same way, but yes, I performed exorcism.

JP: And you were in the Assemblies of God, right?

TH: Yes. Still hold credentials with them. In fact I'm currently doing some consulting work for them at the State level.

JP: The Assemblies of God is the biggest evangelical organization in the world, right?

TH: Used to be. Probably still are.

JP: What do they think about your book and research?

TH: I'm considered a maverick, but in good standing. I had lunch with the State Superintendent and the district Finance Manager last week and the Sup told me he had read The Ahriman Gate.

JP: What did he think of it.

TH: [Tom laughs again] Well, he said my wife and I were very good writers and had kept him very engaged. Then I said, "Okay, so what's the rub?" and he admitted that the Nephilim stuff scared him. He also admitted, as did the finance manager, that the church is woefully unprepared to answer the questions and ramifications raised by my research.

JP: As a matter of fact, this is partly how you started down this road years ago, right.

TH: Right. I was pastoring near Roseburg, Oregon and started noticing that the emerging definitions of so-called alien abduction bore an amazing resemblance to what my sister had experienced throughout her lifetime. In many cases, the story that people around the world were telling was identical to what my family had kept under wraps for decades.

JP: I heard that. Your family never talked about this.

TH: Oh no, no way.

JP: Why?

TH: Lots of reasons. You didn't want people to think you were crazy. Also there wasn't anybody in the church to go to. They would just think you were mentally unstable or demon possessed.

JP: But haven't you come to that conclusion yourself, that demonism is part of alien abduction?

TH: In some cases what is defined as alien abduction parallels historic demonic activity. Even guys like Vallee make this connection. Again, think about this phenomenon as being as complex as the physical world. Many, many layers and attributes. My niece, who was a federal employee for the Social Security division, has had similar experiences and sent me the picture I showed you of what could be the first photographic evidence of an alien Grey standing half inside the frame and looking directly at the camera.

JP: Which brings up the question of generational abduction of your sister and now her daughter. Is the daughter also a Christian?

TH: Yes.

JP: And didn't she get approached by Steven Spielberg's people during the 'Taken' Television series?

TH: She was in Seattle to see a football game with friends. Before the game she was at the Space Needle with her husband, and they got lost. From out of nowhere, a well-dressed man and woman approached them and said, "Come with us, you've been chosen." The man looked military - tall, crew cut hair, firm disposition, and the woman was equally disposed. Both wore 'passes' around their necks with bar-codes on them. After a brief conversation it was learned that the two people worked with Stephen Spielberg. A promotional tent had been set up across the street to promote the television special, 'Taken', about alien abductees. My niece and her husband were excited and agreed to be 'interviewed' in exchange for promotional gifts. Once inside the tent, which was guarded, only those chosen by Spielberg could get in, my niece was asked bizarre questions about her health, dreams, and so on. She learned that the ball stadium was an exact replica of the Close Encounters of the Third Kind Receiving Center. The group of people were led into a room and told to form a circle and hold hands. The lights went out and the room felt like it was twirling around and around, fog filled the room, bright lights flooded in, and a voice said, "You have just been abducted." Different things went on that I'll not take time to explain. Finally my niece was examined and selected by Spielberg as one of two people in Oregon that had likely been abducted. They took her to another room and showed her Spielberg's private collection of authentic 'implants', metallic objects taken from the bodies of abductees.

JP: I understand Dr. Roger Leir - the alien implant researcher - wants copies of these Spielberg implants.

TH: He's asked for them and I've agreed to send them to him.

JP: Getting back to the subject, why now? After all these years, why write a book and go on radio and in other media talking about this?

TH: On December 23, 2002 I was interviewed on American Freedom Network News. Rick Wiles had read an editorial I wrote about the roll that popular films were playing in conditioning culture for a new religion, an ET religion and New Age universalism that would eventually displace traditional Christianity. Toward the end of the one-hour broadcast, Rick ask what would happen if the leaders of the world walked out into the well of the United Nations with ET and made formal official disclosure. His opinion was that it would shake organized Christianity from its foundations and open the door for Antichrist. I agreed, and pointed out how the leaders of the Church, including those I respected and worked with, had their heads intentionally in the sand and were refusing to seriously calculate the theological and philosophical ramifications, leaving their adherents at risk.

JP: Doesn't this go back to the numbers that simply don't believe in UFOs and the related matter?

TH: What numbers? See, Joe, this is the irony in all of this, and I made this point with the Superintendent the other day too. Over 90% of the worlds population believe in God, but almost that many believe in the possibility of extraterrestrial intelligence too. So what numbers? A tiny 10% of the population setting the discussion format for the vast majority? What could be more relevant? If I was still pastoring and I knew that eight out of every ten people in my church believed both in God and ET, wouldn't I have some responsibility to provide legitimate answers to these people, my flock, when their questions about ET, God, cosmology came up? This is one of the reasons people are turning to the New Age adherents, because whether you agree with them or not, they are providing answers and people need answers. The church needs to wake up and consider these facts theologically and philosophically.

JP: Sure, but for you, there's more to this I believe.

TH: Yeah, well, I got off track again. So... there I was, being interviewed on the growing possibilities of official disclosure, and we finished the show and a few days later I got a call from Bob Liparulo wanting to know if he could interview me and use my research information for a feature article he had been hired to write for New Man Magazine - The Gospel According to Star Wars.

JP: You're talking about Robert Liparulo?

TH: Yeah, the author of 'Comes A Horseman' that's coming out next month.

JP: I read something about that.

TH: He's an award-winning author but he also used to be a celebrity journalist. He interviewed guys like Stephen King, Tom Clancy, Charlton Heston for major magazines. Last week in fact he emailed me to let me know the movie rights to his book 'Comes a Horseman' have been optioned to Mace Neufeld, the Hollywood producer that did the movie versions of Tom Clancy’s books like 'The Sum of All Fears', 'Clear and Present Danger', 'Patriot Games', and some others.

JP: So when a guy like that calls, you take the call.

TH: I was happy to do it. But the important point is that the interview with Rick Wiles, the editorials I had written for some major US press, the interview with Liparulo, the New Man Magazine feature story, all of this was almost immediately followed by the old friend of Dad's contacting me. Somehow the high profile comments had rang a bell, and he was in a position to know facts from fiction.

JP: Phobos?

TH: That's what I call him.

JP: And?

TH: He said he had top-down information on what I was talking about. He was a family friend, I hadn't heard from him in years, so we set up a meeting and there have been dozens of meetings since.

JP: You call Phobos a family friend, and I know some of the information he gave you was inserted into the fiction of your new novel, interesting that you did that, but do you really know this guy? Couldn't he be playing you as a disinformation agent?

TH: It's complicated. First, let me say this. After my parents were divorced when I was a teenager, I came home one day and there was this Latin woman in our house. It looked like she had been branded, burned with a mark above one breast. I overheard my Uncle Hubert, who was there, talking to my dad about her being a Mafia Prostitute. Later that week I rode with my dad to the Phoenix airport where we put her on a plane. A couple days later there was this newspaper among my dad's stuff at the house with just a picture of this woman's head on it, and a headline that said something like, "Does Anybody Know This Woman?". I learned years later that she was a Mob prostitute with special information. Dad was keeping her at our home as a safe house, then sending her somewhere in California to meet with somebody over something I know nothing about. She never made it. Just her head was found along a California road. I remember listening in as my dad phoned somebody whose name I won't mention, and this guy took care of things so that dad would not be hurt. So when you ask if Phobos could be using me as a disinfo agent, this is far too complicated to answer in a setting like this. These are connected guys with different responsibilities and agendas. But Phobos has been straight with me, on both sides of the value of info and disinfo.

JP: Disinfo is valuable? In what way?

TH: In many ways. Disinformation is a tool. It can control the flow of information by crediting then discrediting then re-crediting and discrediting.

JP: What?

TH: You know, there has to be a mechanical method for controlling how fast the public assimilates specific information. The military and sophisticated governments use disinformation as a tool for hundreds of years to regulate the pace at which people learn the truth. It's a process of gradualism. Throw something out there that sounds shocking, watch the public reaction, reel in their imaginations by discrediting the sources, then start the process over again. Over time the laws of redundancy, like the boy crying wolf, take over. People hear about it for so long that they become dull to the idea. Finally, when you reveal it as true, everybody reacts like it is old news, not shocking at all, even expected, anticipated.

JP: I don't think anybody would react to official ET disclosure as old news.

TH: Yet polling shows that a vast majority of people are ready to accept the idea now, so the back and forth of info/disinfo played its part over the last fifty years in preparing the world for the specific eventuality.

JP: So... are you admitting that you are a disinfo agent?

TH: I'm not admitting that at all. Look. If a spy carries a half dozen sets of visas, all with different names, does this mean his work is illegitimate? Absolutely not. Disinfo in this sense is a necessary tool to protect his identity in the course of official work. Actors do the same thing all the time, checking into motels using disinformation so that they will be left alone. Government and military schools teach the principles of disinformation under a wide array of applications, and there is no doubt that wars have been won using the principle.

JP: And this is part of official alien disclosure.

TH: Certainly, has to be.

JP: Nevertheless you think you know that date, don't you.

TH: In close proximity.

JP: And it is?

TH: [laughter] You're crazy, right!?

JP: Not even a hint?

TH: I already did that, and it nearly got me in big trouble!

JP: Yeah, I saw the log on and the radio signal jamming. Government and military traces big time. Didn't that worry you.

TH: No.

JP: Why?

TH: There is a side, a part of the government and military that want disclosure now.

JP: Uh, okay, and you see yourself there. So what about ET reality, Is that part of the coming picture too?

TH: Tell you what, Joe, give me the rest of your questions in Yes and No-s and I'll try to answer them.

JP: Can you tell me, is ET reality part of the future, yes or no?

TH: Yes.

JP: Do you define some of the ET reality as demonic?

TH: Yes.

JP: All of it?

TH: No.

JP: Artificial structures off world?

TH: Yes.

JP: Any hard evidence? Pictures, film, materials on hand?

TH: Yes, yes, and yes.

JP: Disclosure this year?

TH: [smiles]

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